Talk:Geocentric model

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Where did the VTSIOM 2-8-2011 survey go?

Article states this: According to 2011 VTSIOM poll, 32% of Russians believe that the Sun orbits the Earth.[60]

Link 60 states this: 'СОЛНЦЕ – СПУТНИК ЗЕМЛИ', ИЛИ РЕЙТИНГ НАУЧНЫХ ЗАБЛУЖДЕНИЙ РОССИЯН ['Sun-earth', or rating scientific fallacies of Russians] (in Russian) (Пресс-выпуск №1684 [Press release no. 1684]), ВЦИОМ [All-Russian Center for the Study of Public Opinion], 2011-02-08.

But Press Release #1684 has no mention of such a poll. Where is this poll?

Mind you Press Release #679 from 2007-4-20 does deal with the same info.

Aristarchus, Pythagoras and "speculations from India"

The reference from John William Draper says,"This approximate determination of the size of the earth tended to depose her from her dominating position, and gave rise to very serious theological results. In this the ancient investigations of Aristarchus of Samos, one of the Alexandrian school, 280 B.C., powerfully aided. In his treatise on the magnitudes and distances of the sun and moon, he explains the ingenious though imperfect method to which he had resorted for the solution of that problem. Many ages previously a speculation had been brought from India to Europe by Pythagoras. It presented the sun as the centre of the system. Around him the planets revolved in circular orbits, their order of position being Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, each of them being supposed to rotate on its axis as it revolved round the sun. According to Cicero, Nicetas suggested that, if it were admitted that the earth revolves on her axis, the difficulty presented by the inconceivable velocity of the heavens would be avoided."

So the correct ordering of the planets is attributed to "speculations from India", brought to Greece by Pythagoras and adopted by Aristarchus. Is this a currently accepted view, or an eccentric interpretation of what little is available of the original writings of Aristarchus? Rjm at sleepers (talk) 07:31, 25 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Offhand, I'd take Draper's historical account with a grain of salt. A lot of historical work on the relations among Indian, Greek, and Babylonian astronomy has been done since Draper wrote in the mid-19th century. Although it's less relevant to this point, his book is widely seen as tendentious and not even reflecting the state of historical research at the time that he wrote. --SteveMcCluskey (talk) 18:01, 25 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I suspected that might be the case. Is there a more reliable source that says Aristarchus gave the correct ordering of the known planets? Should the statement that he did be removed from the article? Rjm at sleepers (talk) 05:55, 26 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Confusing statement about Ptolemaic being geocentric

"Because of its influence, people sometimes wrongly think the Ptolemaic system is identical with the geocentric model."

What does this mean? Isn't the Ptolemaic model a geocentric model? Is it not a subset of possible geocentric models? If so, how can a single model be or not be equivalent to a set of models? It is not clear at all what this sentence is supposed to mean.

Betaneptune (talk) 04:34, 4 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is not a forum (see below) but in answer to the question about the text of the article as it stands, the sentence is saying that the cultural influence of the Ptolemaic system was so widespread that some people wrongly think that this geocentric model (ie the Ptolemaic model) is the only member of the set of geocentric models. As the article shows, there were several versions of the geocentric paradigm. Orbitalforam (talk) 09:51, 19 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it is clear, but this page, "Geocentric model," entirely focuses on the "Ptolemaic system," making the difference between the two concepts unclear. Moreover, we have a page for the "Tychonic system" (another geocentric model), but we don't have a specific page for the "Ptolemaic system." Instead, they should be presented independently as instances of the geocentric model.

I would recommend changing at least the chapter title "Geocentrism and rival systems" to "Ptolemaic and rival systems" because the chapter discusses the problem of the Ptolemaic model against Copernican heliocentrism and the subsequent introduction of the Tychonic system. This last one became a new rival system for the Ptolemaic system.

To make concepts even more precise, I think a new page, "Ptolemaic system," should be created to contain all the details on the Ptolemaic model. We have a similar arrangement on heliocentrism: two distinct pages, Heliocentrism and Copernican model.

In any case, on this same topic, I just changed the description of the image of the Venus' phases, which was erroneous in itself. Venus's observation made by Galileo in 1610 disproved the Ptolemaic, not the Tychonic system. Bg69 (talk) 19:08, 6 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Science

What is the heliocentric 112.198.87.46 (talk) 06:07, 13 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This is an old post but I nonetheless feel the need to answer it for those who read this in the future. The heliocentric theory is that the Sun is the center of the universe (which, the universe’s center being ill-defined, it is not).

Also, Wikipedia is WP:NOTAFORUM. OverzealousAutocorrect (talk) 17:14, 14 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]